Author Topic: Help with a mizzen  (Read 3042 times)

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Help with a mizzen
« on: April 07, 2014, 02:36:54 PM »

Tim Willey
Username: Tim_willey

Registered: 03-2012
   
Posted on Friday, June 07, 2013 - 04:10 pm:      
After reading Martin's lovely Winkle Brig Book I was particularly taken with the sections on motor sailing. I thought how useful it would be for me to sail just under mizzen and jib when I'm out sketching wildlife on the Norfolk Broads. Stealthily quiet but with an engine for back up, the cockpit free of clutter (on these occasions I would leave the mainsail, gaff and boom back at home) and a much less restricted view of the landscape.

Looking at a spare topsail I have, it does look about the right size and shape for a Bermudan style mizzen but I know there are important questions of balance to consider. I would obviously have to make a bumpkin and mizzen mast and find a way of stepping these somewhere aft of the tiller.

Anybody got any thoughts?

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2014, 02:37:11 PM »

Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Friday, June 07, 2013 - 06:33 pm:      
Firstly, many thanks for the compliment about the book!
I have been meaning to post some photos and details of my mizzen for some time, as others have asked me about it. This will spur me on to get on with it! Watch this space.

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2014, 02:41:46 PM »

Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Saturday, June 08, 2013 - 11:29 am:      
Here it is:- Sorry this is a bit long but I discovered that small modifications I made over a number of years actually added up to quite an involved project.
First I removed the timber transom rail from the four grp ‘posts’ and replaced it with a 70mm square old oak gatepost. As the post needs to be curved in two planes in order to fit snugly on the posts this takes a bit of ‘fettling’. The timber post can be bolted through the grp posts with stainless studding with a dome nut on top. A bit fiddly getting a spanner to the nut on the underside – but possible.
On top of the oak post I fitted a timber ‘cup’ for the base of the mast to fit into. (There must be a nautical name for this, but I don’t know what it is). You can use almost anything as all it does is stop the base of the mast from moving. I used an old teak type wood Parasol fitting.
I adapted another parasol fitting to act as a collar higher up and bolted this through the gallows. Thus the gallows are taking the strain – both fore and aft and lateral. I sailed like this for many years, but when I had the stainless steel pushpit rail fitted I included a collar in this so that if the parasol collar failed the mast would stay up. It hasn’t so far.
One point to note here is that as the gallows are supporting the mast, they must be supported on something substantial. Mine were deck mounted, which I was not happy with, so I increased the length of the stainless tube ‘legs’ and fixed them to the locker floor.

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2014, 02:42:07 PM »
Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Saturday, June 08, 2013 - 11:40 am:      
Sorry! Julian can you shrink or remove this image for me. I will try to make it smaller.

To continue:-The bumpkin:- I started with a straight round section bumpkin through a hole in the transom with a small square section cut in the end, fitting into a timber square socket inside one of the aft lockers. (Similar to the principle of the bowsprit fitting). If you do this and run the bumpkin down the inside face of the locker (ie the engine well wall), you will find that it is not at right angles with the transom and the end of the bumpkin is well off centre. I sailed for many years like this (as the Drascombes do) but eventually convinced myself that I would sail much better if I had a curved bumpkin, so that the mizzen sail would sheet in to the centre on both tacks.
There are numerous options for the mizzen rig. I sailed with a Bermudan for a while, now I have a gaff rig and I am currently thinking of converting it to a balanced lugsail to match my new mainsail. I started without a boom but sailed very happily at Morbihan this year with one. Whatever you choose, make sure the mast is of a height which removes easily and fits into the cabin bundled together with the sail, gaff, boom and bumpkin.I find a 2.3m mast fits fine.
Here are the dimensions of my sail which is roughly balanced with the other sails, but I must emphasise that I have an extended bowsprit and two headsails so this may be too large a sail area for a standard rig. (The drawing shows a standard dimensioned Winkle Brig - not mine).

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2014, 02:43:33 PM »
Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Saturday, June 08, 2013 - 11:40 am:      
Sorry! Julian can you shrink or remove this image for me. I will try to make it smaller.

To continue:-The bumpkin:- I started with a straight round section bumpkin through a hole in the transom with a small square section cut in the end, fitting into a timber square socket inside one of the aft lockers. (Similar to the principle of the bowsprit fitting). If you do this and run the bumpkin down the inside face of the locker (ie the engine well wall), you will find that it is not at right angles with the transom and the end of the bumpkin is well off centre. I sailed for many years like this (as the Drascombes do) but eventually convinced myself that I would sail much better if I had a curved bumpkin, so that the mizzen sail would sheet in to the centre on both tacks.
There are numerous options for the mizzen rig. I sailed with a Bermudan for a while, now I have a gaff rig and I am currently thinking of converting it to a balanced lugsail to match my new mainsail. I started without a boom but sailed very happily at Morbihan this year with one. Whatever you choose, make sure the mast is of a height which removes easily and fits into the cabin bundled together with the sail, gaff, boom and bumpkin.I find a 2.3m mast fits fine.
Here are the dimensions of my sail which is roughly balanced with the other sails, but I must emphasise that I have an extended bowsprit and two headsails so this may be too large a sail area for a standard rig. (The drawing shows a standard dimensioned Winkle Brig - not mine).

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2014, 02:43:53 PM »
Tim Willey
Username: Tim_willey

Registered: 03-2012
   
Posted on Sunday, June 09, 2013 - 09:35 am:      
Thanks for uploading this Martin - really useful information. From your drawing, I've roughly worked out the area of your mizzen to be pretty similar to my spare topsail's of 20+ square feet (does that sound right?). However I do take your point about your two headsails and my first thought was to calculate the centre of effort of a standard rig and see how my mizzen/jib configuration would compare. But then I guess there are so many variables at work (including my mathematical abilities) that I might as well try a lash-up and see how it goes. Exciting stuff; I'll post up any developments.

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2014, 02:44:08 PM »

Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Sunday, June 09, 2013 - 11:42 am:      
I think trial and error is the only way!
I have a spare bermudan cut mizzen sail if you want it. (Postage cost only).

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2014, 02:44:24 PM »
Tim Willey
Username: Tim_willey

Registered: 03-2012
   
Posted on Sunday, June 09, 2013 - 06:58 pm:      
That sounds wonderful Martin, can we post contact details on the forum ?

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2014, 02:44:41 PM »

Martin_cartwright
Username: Martin_cartwright

Registered: 04-2008
   
Posted on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 08:34 am:      
Give me a ring on 07860 163481.

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2014, 02:45:19 PM »

Tim Willey
Username: Tim_willey

Registered: 03-2012
   
Posted on Sunday, June 30, 2013 - 08:14 am:      
After a good deal of cut and fit (and cut again) I managed to put together the prototype mizzen. In keeping with the rest of the little ship's after-market rig, the materials were sourced from odds and ends. The mast is the butt section of a fishing rod and the bumpkin is cut from of an old oar. You might also recognise that the self-furling jib is a section of waste pipe connected to 2 discs cut from a nylon chopping board (which also explains the smell of onions which seems to accompany our voyages). I'll give the rig a try on the Broads soon and post up the results. Thanks again for the sail Martin.

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Re: Help with a mizzen
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2014, 02:45:39 PM »

Tim Willey
Username: Tim_willey

Registered: 03-2012
   
Posted on Friday, July 12, 2013 - 11:49 am:      
I managed to get out on the Broads for a couple of days, and I'm pleased to
say that the mizzen and jib worked really well together. What I didn't expect
was how the slightest adjustment of trim would balance the boat and even
steer it quite effectively. Not much use up into the wind of course (without
'motor-assist') but up to a beam reach - she trickled along nicely.

Not for everyday use maybe; but by leaving the main at home along with
the boom and gaff, I had an efficient open working-boat that is perfect for
fishing, bird-watching, sketching and just messing about.

So with thanks to
this forum - it's Just what I wanted .